Airsoft Canada

Airsoft Canada (https://airsoftcanada.com/forums.php)
-   Airsoft Guns Discussion (https://airsoftcanada.com/forumdisplay.php?f=53)
-   -   Airsoft / Clearsoft - Long Term Reliability Study (https://airsoftcanada.com/showthread.php?t=36977)

Bravo One-Six April 6th, 2007 11:32

Airsoft / Clearsoft - Long Term Reliability Study
 
When you decide to enter the world of Airsoft in 2007, you're confronted with a plethora of choices. What used to be a simple decision is now confounded by dozens of manufacturers and products. In addition, there seems to be no clear answer as to which of the various options best suits your needs as debates regarding the various makes and models and their quality abound. Is it better to buy a Tokyo Marui gun, or will a cheaper model suit your needs? Has the quality of the less popular/less expensive manufacturers improved, and how do they perform over the long run?

This post will attempt to answer that question with your help.

The concept is to track the owners of various makes and models of weapons and the performance of said models on a few key points. These are recorded over the long term and posted here in order to help individuals make informed decisions about the guns they intend to purchase.

The key points are as follows:
1) Manufacturer, Model Name (name of weapon on box, and weapon replicated if different from model name)
-
2) Date Obtained
-
3) Initial Cost
-
4) New or Used
-
5) Mechanical Problems (Gearbox issues, hopup issues.. basically functional performance related -- supply date of issue)
-
6) Esthetic Problems (Paint damage, cracks in body, loose parts.. physical construction related -- supply date of issue)
-
7) Rounds fired between failures (think how many bags of BB's used before it failed. If no failure, list rounds fired up to this point)
-
8) Changes to Internals and Externals (upgrades, mods, dates)
-
9) Resale Date and Value if applicable.
-
10)Notes and Comments (Optional)
-

***THE IMPORTANT NOTES/RULES FOR SUBMISSION***
1) You may only submit information for a gun YOU OWN personally. No 'friend of friend' second hand information
2) ONLY MAKE ONE POST, and edit it to update your information.
3) This is open to ANYONE who owns a gun, and I specifically encourage individuals with 'clearsoft' or less well known manufacturers (Well, CYMA) to participate.
4) Please remember you are contributing FACTS about your gun. If you have any opinions on it, please state them in point 10 only. Only put in esthetic/performance related issues if it malfunctioned (something broke, wobbly, etc). If it doesn't shoot fast enough out of the box, that's an opinion and should be stated in point 10.


I've had a few requests to add information into the product conclusions in the next post. Most specifically, add in the selling price. I would consider this but since most of the guns are selling after modifications, an average price wouldn't be very accurate. If you're looking to see the market value of a specific gun, take a look at the various reports for each weapon to see which one matches what you're looking for / what you have. Keep in mind that prices can fluctuate with time as well. The price of a gun sold 3 years ago might not be the price of it now.

Bravo One-Six April 6th, 2007 11:33

GENERAL CONCLUSIONS DRAWN FROM RESPONSES
1) Common well known brand names (Tokyo Marui, KJW...) have higher resale value than those of their less-well known counterparts (Crossman, Daisy...). Investing in a known brand name gun will likely result in you recouperating ~85-90% of its original value. Less-well known brand names on average will result in a 50% recouperation of investment.



MODEL SPECIFIC CONCLUSIONS
** Model must be listed at least 3 times by separate people before any conclusions are drawn**

Academy
L85A1 -- 1

Classic Army
M15A4 CQB -- 1
SAR TarikII -- 1
SLR 105 (Steel Ver.) -- 1
CA 33 -- 1
CA36 - General Conclusions
User Submitted Data: 1 -- 2 -- 3
Common Problems: Charging/Cocking lever snaps easily (+2). Screws, switches may become loose/be lost.
Common Failures: None. One aftermarket piston strip, one wireing issue.
Common Esthetic Changes: None.
Common Internal Changes: None.
Other Notes: Reports of internal issues mostly due to upgrades. Can be picky with certain upgrade parts/manufacturers. Cocking lever/charging handle prone to breakage.

CA249 MkII- General Conclusions
User Submitted Data: 1 -- 2 -- 3
Common Problems: None. Few external wear issues with bipod/carry handle.
Common Failures: None. Some issues with stock internals.
Common Esthetic Changes: None.
Common Internal Changes: Piston upgrades. Some full internal changeouts.
Other Notes: None.




Crossman
P22 -- 1 -- 2 -- 3
M4 (Clear) -- 1
R30 (Old Version) -- 1
Colt 1911 -- 1
Stinger - General Conclusions
User Submitted Data: 1 -- 2 -- 3
Common Problems: Fragile body and plastic parts prone to cracking.
Common Failures: None - One catastrophic failure reported.
Common Esthetic Changes: None.
Common Internal Changes: Stretching of spring.
Other Notes: Shoots only one BB, not 3 like TM counterpart. Users report satisfaction in range and fps. Numerous rounds fired without major failure. Stretching spring for increased power may result in catastrophic failure of gun.

P22 - General Conclusions
User Submitted Data: 1 -- 2 -- 3
Common Problems: Trigger becomes loose or breaks (once due to loose safety). Magazine lips wear down. Outer barrel wear after prolonged use.
Common Failures: None.
Common Esthetic Changes: None.
Common Internal Changes: None. Stretching of spring.
Other Notes: None.



Cyma
Cm031 (AK74M) -- 1 -- 2
Cm028-S -- 1


Daisy
Airstrike 240 -- 1

G&G
GR16 R4 (M4 RIS) -- 1
GR16 R5 (M16A3 RAS) -- 1
GR16 R2 -- 1

G&P
M249 Ranger -- 1
SPR & M203 -- 1 -- 2


GWS (Redwolf)
XM8 -- 1
SL8 -- 1

HFC
HG-185 (Glock 17) -- 1

ICS
MP5A4 -- 1 -- 2
M4A1 -- 1 -- 2 -- 3
AK74 -- 1

KJW
Elite (92F) -- 1
G23 -- 1
G23C -- 1
M9 Vertec -- 1
Para 14.45 -- 1
P229 -- 1

KSC
Glock 18c -- 1
Glock 19 -- 1
Glock 19 HW (Taiwan) -- 1 (Two Different Guns)
Glock 23F -- 1
USP .45 -- 1 -- 2
USP Compact -- 1
M11A1 -- 1 -- 2

KWA
Glock 26c -- 1

KWC
Desert Eagle -- 1
Sigma 40F -- 1

SoftAir USA
P226 -- 1

Star
M249 Para -- 1
L85A2 -- 1

Sun Project
M40A1 -- 1

Tanaka
M700 AICS -- 1

Tokyo Marui
AK47 -- 1
AUG A2 (SR-Type) -- 1
Desert Eagle (Chrome, new gen) -- 1
FA-MAS F1 -- 1
G36C -- 1 -- 2 -- 3
G3A3 -- 1
G3 SAS -- 1
G3SG1 -- 1
M14 OD -- 1
M14 Socom -- 1
M16A2 -- 1 -- 2
M1911A1 -- 1 -- 2 -- 3
M3 Super 90 -- 1 -- 2
M4A1 -- 1 -- 2 -- 3 -- 4
M4-S -- 1
M733 -- 1
M9 Tactical Master -- 1
Mk23 Socom -- 1
MP5 A4 (HG) -- 1
MP5K -- 1
MP5 SD5 -- 1 -- 2
MP7 -- 1
P90 RD -- 1
Sig 552 -- 1
SR-16 -- 1 -- 2
VSR-10 G-Spec -- 1 -- 2
P226 - General Conclusions
User Submitted Data: 1 -- 2 -- 3 -- 4 (4 Separate Guns)
Common Problems: None, Isolated reports of slide wear.
Common Failures: None - No failures reported.
Common Esthetic Changes: None, Occational metal kit upgrade.
Common Internal Changes: Piston head, recoil/hammer spring.
Other Notes: All run on propane in stock form with isolated/no issues. Reliable - hundreds/thousands of rounds fired without failure.


UTG
MP5 -- 1
M87-SA (Spring, Clear) -- 1

Western Arms
4.3 SVI Expert -- 1
Beretta PV -- 1

WE
Dark Dragon Type B -- 1 -- 2
HiCapa 5.1 Dragon (v1) -- 1
M1911A1 -- 1

WGC
MI6VN -- 1

Bravo One-Six April 6th, 2007 11:41

1) Make and Model
-- M249 MKII, Classic Army
2) Date Purchased
-- January 2007
3) Cost
-- $1600
4) New/Used?
-- Used
5) Mechanical Problems
-- N/A
6) Esthetic Problems
-- Slightly Loose Carry Handle (Jan-07)
-- Noticed small crack in stock near body (Apr-07)
7) Rounds Fired Between Failures
-- N/A (2500 to date)
8) Changes to Internals & Externals
-- N/A
9) Resale Date and Value
-- N/A

Bravo One-Six April 6th, 2007 11:50

1) Make and Model
-- M16A2, Tokyo Marui
2) Date Purchased
-- 2001
3) Cost
-- $500
4) New/Used?
-- New
5) Mechanical Problems

-- Worn Piston (2003)
-- Nozzle Bent (2006)
6) Esthetic Problems
-- Body Tab Cracked (2002, 2003)
-- Barrel Wobble (2003)
7) Rounds Fired Between Failures
-- 20-30k (Failed with bent nozzle - 2006)
-- Rough gameplay resulting in cracked body tabs (2002, 2003)
8) Changes to Internals
-- Upgraded Spring (2003)
-- New Spring Guide/Bushings (2003)
-- New Piston (2003)
-- Used Nozzle (2006)
-- External changes include new G&P M16VN front end, modified REAL stock (to blame for nozzle damage), G&P pistol grip.
9) Resale Date and Value
-- N/A

Coma April 6th, 2007 11:50

1) Manufacturer, Model Name
Crosman Stinger something or other. Looks like a SPAS 12 pump action.
2) Date Obtained
Sometime during the spring of 2005
3) Initial Cost
About $100
4) New or Used
Brand spanking new
5) Mechanical Problems (Gearbox issues, hopup issues.. basically functional performance related)
None that I can remember. If there were, I fixed them cause it still works.
6) Esthetic Problems (Paint damage, cracks in body, loose parts.. physical construction related)
The top of the heatshield had a crack running down it from front to back. That was mostly my fault from modding in a front sling swivel.
7) Rounds fired between failures (think how many bags of BB's used before it failed)
A shitload, I don't even remember.
8) Changes to Internals (upgrades, dates)
Opened it and streched the spring by hand the day after I got it.
9) Resale Date and Value if applicable.
I'm never selling, it was my first anything that fired a pellet. If I were to, it'd probably go for about $20

Kid April 6th, 2007 12:02

1) Manufacturer, Model Name
Crosman P22
2) Date Obtained
Summer of 2004
3) Initial Cost
About $40
4) New or Used
Brand spanking new
5) Mechanical Problems (Gearbox issues, hopup issues.. basically functional performance related)
Outer barrel broke loose and needed to be glued onto the body. No further problems with this.
6) Esthetic Problems (Paint damage, cracks in body, loose parts.. physical construction related)Magazine lips began to wear down and would only hold 15 of 20 BBs reliably.
Slide got a large crack after being thrown like a baseball at a stone fireplace. Still worked and crack did not increase with careful use.
7) Rounds fired between failures (think how many bags of BB's used before it failed)
10,000-12,000
8) Changes to Internals (upgrades, dates)
Oiled with silicone oil and Super Lube. Didn't help much. (around 2000rnds)
9) Resale Date and Value if applicable.
Summer of 2006. $15.

Bravo One-Six April 6th, 2007 12:03

Coma, could you get the model name/number from a website or something? I'd like to make sure that we're documenting specific models so that we can see if specific items have specific flaws/issues.

Also, we need estimates for the number of rounds fired (think bags of bb's used as it gives you a better idea). Only post resale info if you have sold it, that way we can get an accurate idea of depreciation of the gun.

Bravo One-Six April 6th, 2007 12:04

Also guys, please give dates (at least the year) that the issues with esthetics or fuction occured. We need to be able to get an idea of how long the weapon held out.

Kid April 6th, 2007 12:07

1) Manufacturer, Model Name
Crosman M4 (spring, clear)
2) Date Obtained
Spring of 2006
3) Initial Cost
About $100
4) New or Used
Brand spanking new
5) Mechanical Problems (Gearbox issues, hopup issues.. basically functional performance related)
Plastic rod holding internal piston catch broke. (Drilled a hole all the way through, used a nail and never gave me a problem again.
Piston broke where it is held back. (unfixable)
6) Esthetic Problems (Paint damage, cracks in body, loose parts.. physical construction related)
Stock broke (too weighted, unfixable)
7) Rounds fired between failures (think how many bags of BB's used before it failed)2000
8) Changes to Internals (upgrades, dates)
Oiled. Summer of 2006
9) Resale Date and Value if applicable.
Fall of 2006. $50. (before piston broke)

Kid April 6th, 2007 12:11

1) Manufacturer, Model Name
Daisy Airstrike 240
2) Date Obtained
Summer of 2005
3) Initial Cost
About $40
4) New or Used
Brand spanking new
5) Mechanical Problems (Gearbox issues, hopup issues.. basically functional performance related)
Outer barrel broke loose and needed to be glued onto the body. No further problems with this.
Seal lost and gun would no longer fire more than 1 foot. No physical damage to the internals of the gun.
6) Esthetic Problems (Paint damage, cracks in body, loose parts.. physical construction related)Magazine lips began to wear down and would only hold 15 of 20 BBs reliably.
None so far.
7) Rounds fired between failures (think how many bags of BB's used before it failed)
3,000
8) Changes to Internals (upgrades, dates)
Oiled with silicone oil and Super Lube. Didn't help much. (after failure, 3000rnd)
9) Resale Date and Value if applicable.
Summer of 2006. $15.

Greylocks April 6th, 2007 12:16

1) Make and Model
-- AK47, TM
2) Date Purchased
-- I forget, been that long. Before 2000?
3) Cost
-- About $450
4) New/Used?
-- New
5) Mechanical Problems
-- None
6) Esthetic Problems
-- Fake wood did not look that great.
7) Rounds Fired Between Failures
-- Thousands, failure was dirt that somehow got into the mechbox after 2 seasons.
8) Changes to Internals
-- Upgraded Spring, then back to the stock spring.
-- Spring Guide/Bushings
-- New Piston (once, replaced with a stock Marui spring)
-- New mechbox (screws closing it had stripped)
-- Metal body (was not needed, I just felt like it)
9) Resale Date and Value
-- No idea, keeping it.

I also have a Marui Spetz. It has a PDI150 (or close to it plus metal bushings) and the rest is 'stock'. Works like a charm.

Kid April 6th, 2007 12:17

1) Manufacturer, Model Name
ICS MP5A4
2) Date Obtained
Summer of 2005
3) Initial Cost
$535
4) New or Used
Brand spanking new
5) Mechanical Problems (Gearbox issues, hopup issues.. basically functional performance related)
Noise level concerned me.
6) Esthetic Problems (Paint damage, cracks in body, loose parts.. physical construction related)
Magazine would NOT hold itself in and would constantly wiggle itself out far enough that it would not feed. Would only feed 15-30rnds reliably without the magazine being held in by hand. (stock highcap)
7) Rounds fired between failures (think how many bags of BB's used before it failed)
Came like this. (used 8000 total)
8) Changes to Internals (upgrades, dates)
Oiled barrel. (constant)
9) Resale Date and Value if applicable.
Fall of 2005. $500-550.

Kid April 6th, 2007 12:20

1) Manufacturer, Model Name
KJ G23
2) Date Obtained
Summer of 2005
3) Initial Cost
$230
4) New or Used
Brand spanking new
5) Mechanical Problems (Gearbox issues, hopup issues.. basically functional performance related)
None.
6) Esthetic Problems (Paint damage, cracks in body, loose parts.. physical construction related)
Magazine had normal wear on it.
7) Rounds fired between failures (think how many bags of BB's used before it failed)
4000-8000rnds fired, no failure.
8) Changes to Internals (upgrades, dates)
Oiled with silicone oil. Used propane all the time. (constant)
9) Resale Date and Value if applicable.
Winter 2006. $200-230.

Bravo One-Six April 6th, 2007 12:22

Guys, again, try to provide dates. At the very least, at least give the year for any failures/internal work.

Bravo One-Six April 6th, 2007 12:26

KJW Elite
 
1) Make and Model
-- Elite (92F), KJW
2) Date Purchased
-- April 2007
3) Cost
-- $165
4) New/Used?
-- Used
5) Mechanical Problems
-- Trigger Return Spring Broken (as advertised - March 2007)
6) Esthetic Problems
-- Stripped screw hole on right side grip.
7) Rounds Fired Between Failures
-- N/A
8) Changes to Internals
-- Replaced Trigger Spring (April 2007)
9) Resale Date and Value
-- N/A


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:05.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.