Is there any good airsoft green gas pistols out there?
 

What is the most reliable, durabe, realistic green gas full metal pistol out there?
I'm talking here about a pistol that will never fail, something that can be litteraly trown around, tossed around, dropped, etc. Basicaly something that wont break but that is still realistic and full meta of course. ( I'm not planning to trow my guns around)

give me your thoughts.

Kj works are reliable in my experience but that being said nothing will last a constant beating, even if u treat it good u will have to do maintenance at some point, but I got two kjw a m9 co2 and 1911 green gas both been working great.

just be advised that there's no brand that will never fail... even a TM can break down. Guns are just like cars... you use them, expect them to break at some point...

KSC/KWA pistols are good but spare parts are hard to get
KJW, on the other hand are easy to find replacement parts if they break
same thing for the TM ones... except they are plastic/abs... but damn good pistols!

this is airsoft. shit breaks.

exactly, it doesn't matter what kind of airsoft it is the sooner you can accept that it's a toy and toys break the less heartache it will be when your $2000 uber elite race gun snapped in half. If anyone tells you there is a indestructible airsoft gun out there he/she is feeding you the biggest pile of shit around, some of us myself included have seen everything that has come out in the last 20years and I have yet to see a indestructible airsoft gun. some came close but not close enough.

The only one that doesn't break is the one you use as a display piece.

I have a PTW body who's motor mount broke and have seen ones that have gone down.

With a good maintenance schedule you can make it last longer but it will still eventually break internally, or if you're too hard on it break externally as well. Think of a bike, you still have to do maintenance on it every so often and there are maintenance schedules based on the mileage you put on.

If you want something that's fairly durable and requires longer maintenance intervals get a TM and slap on an FMU kit on it (beware you're going to get lower gas efficiency due to the increased weight of the FMU kit), a KJW, or a KWA/KSC.

with the cost of TMs (well big buzz is helping with this lately) I don't find it economically sound to buy an ABS TM pistol in country for 2-3x the price of what it costs in japan, to spend another pistols worth of money on a metal upgrade kit, with mags; when you can just buy a KJW which is about 90% TM compatible already full metal and does just as well out of the box.

That's just me though, people can spend their money however they want. But comparing the TM 5-7 I just bought with the KWA 226 I already have, the kwa worked fine out of the box and had no issues, whereas the TM using propane is operating far out of its design specs, and will break sooner rather than later, even with all the mods I've done to it to try and stave off the inevitable.

If another manufacturer came out with a propane/gg ready 5-7 I'd buy it in an instant.

kwa pistols are great, and their parts are not that hard to find, just get them from kwa usa. Upgrade parts are a bit more rare, but what do you really need to upgrade on a pistol? with .28s my kwa 226 will shoot straight out to 50m, far more than I need in a secondary.

KWA, mine has fallen out of my holster onto rocks, cement, a road... Rear sight shot off and then screwed back on... Gun got so dirty at a game that BBs turned brown before they got half way down the mag, and I ran it for the rest of the day with no cycling issues. KWA GBBs are pretty tanky.

KJW and KWA are the way to go in my opinion. I have a KJW P226 and KWA HK45, both are great guns but my preference between either is the HK45. It manages gas better with its NS2 system, and overall great performance.

Tokyo Marui 1911 Series. Leave it as completely stock, plastic guns, and you will be able to beat these things senseless, but they'll keep coming back for more.

If a part does wear down or break, the Tokyo Marui 1911 and Hi-Capa series has the greatest aftermarket support on the market, with very few other platforms coming close to comparison. Anything else is a very distant second place in terms of support and ability to find replacement parts.

I've had a number of them come across my workbench that had tens of thousands of rounds put through them for cleaning/maintenance/tune up, but they were still functioning fine, despite the amount of dirt inside and general wear on them.


KSC/KWA guns are decent, but engineering-wise, they have a number of flaws. For one, their hop up rubber is extremely sensitive to the lubricants we use. Funny enough, they are highly reactive to silicone oil, and it's always been standard practice to keep a handful of backup rubbers on hand to replace them over time.

Secondly, their hop up system is not very precise. Performance wise, their groupings tend to be much larger than Tokyo Marui's. KSC/KWA guns do have very hard kicking blowback though, and are very solid built guns overall. However, aftermarket support is limited, which is one of the main reasons I would still prefer Tokyo Marui for my own personal armoury. I deal with the KWA Pro Shop a lot, and while they're a great source for getting stock parts, I find that more often than not, parts that I need are out of stock with long backorder time spans.

I do own a few KSC products, so I don't have a complete aversion to them, and like them overall. But Tokyo Marui will always be my preferred choice. As a direct comparison, the Tokyo Marui MP7 is miles ahead of the KSC/KWA version in terms of build quality, heft, material feel, accuracy, range, and blowback power.

+1 for KWA. Also parts are easy to get for KWA, from their pro shop.

Not that I would disagree about anything regarding TM's, but they aren't all that easy to come across, and they come with the price.

I'll agree on the difficulty of finding them. Even I have a hard time getting my hands on them at times.

As for the price... you get what you pay for... most of the time. Don't buy Inokatsu. LOL.

what about western arms, why hasnt this been suggested? or am i missing something after being gone a while?

Tokyo Marui. Not full metal, but the most reliable performer you can buy. KWA is decent for the cost, but also ABS.

Western Arms has fallen out of popularity for a number of reasons:

1) Although they are the nicest feeling guns out of the box, they come with a very significant price increase over the next best competitor: Tokyo Marui.

2) Despite the huge price increase, their durability is, at best, is worse than WE or KJW pistols when used with propane due to the fact that they are designed for lower powered duster gas. Their number one failure point is the slide. Airsoft Innovations at one point, made a flow restrictor valve to reduce the gas power put to the slide, which allowed users to use propane. With this combination, you would have an amazing feeling pistol, with HUGE blowback power. Western Arms blowback is still one of the best in the industry, fresh out of the box.

3) Their hop up system sucks. Period. It's like a KJW/KWA system with the ball bearing on the top... but worse... because there's also a point on the BOTTOM, created by a screw that applied pressure to the top hop nub. I understand the theory behind the design, but it creates a very inaccurate shot. If the round was seated off to one side, then it would fly off to the opposite side upon leaving the muzzle. Groupings were crap, at best. Many enthusiasts shoe horned Tokyo Marui's superior hop up system in to Western Arms. It seemed to work fine for CQB, so if the user had no intention on using these guns for <40 foot engagements (as is typical with competitive shooters), then the crap groupings didn't matter too much, as hop up could be turned off completely to avoid these grouping issues.

4) Their positive pressure valve system sucks. Period. It starts the blowback cycle the moment the BB has left its position in the chamber. This is bad, because the power of the slide blowing back will throw the shot off before it's even left the muzzle. This is NOT how a real gun functions, and Tokyo Marui is much better at replicating the firing action of a real gun, using a negative pressure valve system. The negative pressure system allows the projectile to fully leave the barrel, before the slide cycle begins. Just like a real gun.

5) Extremely EXPENSIVE magazines and parts.... assuming you could even find them.

6) That leads to the final issue, of the inability to find parts for them these days. Because of all the above issues, Western Arms aftermarket support (or even OEM support, for that matter), fell to the wayside in favour of all the many more positive attributes of Tokyo Marui platforms.

That isn't to say that Western Arms doesn't have any aftermarket support... if anything, they have the deepest support with ultra high end custom parts manufacturers, since the Western Arms platform did have many positive attributes that Tokyo Marui can't come close to. Primarily, their barrel linkage system in their 1911/Hi-Cap series, as well as their hard kicking blowback system. But again, that leads back to point #6, which is EXTREMELY expensive parts... and people say ILLusion Kinetics parts for the Marui system was expensive... you should see how much our Western Arms parts are. It would make you faint.

But yeah... beautifully built guns out of the box. Great heft, and despite being made of plastic, their slides had a great heft to them. Too bad they were so brittle, which was the major source of their problems.

Because if it breaks you're boned unless you have another donor gun to gut parts from. Also, you have to qualify it with which system Magna, SCW, SCW2, etc.

IMO they're more show pieces than something that's gameable and they definitely need to be run on duster because from what I can tell most people seem to say that propane/greengas is too hard on them and severely shortens it's lifespan.

KWA HK45 - mud, dirt, rain, mushy bio bbs, hmm what else, dropped on rocks, mags slammed against rocks, hmm basically mine has been pretty abused? Not a bad user, just a typical hardcore airsoft player. Welcome to the club! Using king arms gas and periodic cleaning, this pistol is the best IMO! I have had no issues and shoots just as straight as day one ... yes it shot very good on day one! it uses the new split hopup and gas efficiency is pretty good using ns2! 2 mags per fill. Clean with a heavy weight oil. no issues!
ps my classic army 1911 had lots of leaky mags. something I have never had to deal with yet with my kwa mags

Classic Army made GBB's? Neat. I'd never seen or heard of them before. I'm guessing they were junk, like their first generation AEG's...

Is Classic Army even around anymore? They've had so many legal troubles since their start... I heard their flagship store in Hong Kong recently closed as well.

You do also know green gas = propane right? Green Gas is just a marketing ploy to drain you of more money.

nope flagship store still operating.. I ordered parts from them last month.

Off topic, how the fuck did you manage to get a hold of them and place an order?

I emailed the info address at classic army and said my local vendors haven't been able to do shit for me, and I needed the parts, they forwarded the mail to the sales dept at the store (they said they would direct me to the flagship store in HK) who priced me out the parts and then I had a 2-3 wait for them to get the parts from factory.

Whether or not it actually was their store or some other guy's desk across the office, I have no way of knowing for sure... but my parts are likely at the post office right now waiting for pickup since I have a missed parcel tag in my hand.

Derp post

Kwc co2 1911s are very good, full metal body, very powerfull, they're pretty cheap and look better the more you wear em down.

Sigh.

I've probably several thousands of rounds through my KJW M9, never had a problem with the gun. Ever. Tough as nails. Metal feels reel nice. The mags, however, another story. Of the 4 mags I got with the gun and separate, they all leaked. Fixable, but frustrating.

Correct me if Im wrong here...but does green gas (propane bottled for airsoft use) not have an added lubricant in it so it does not dry out o-rings and such?
Hence the need for adding your own lubricant/silicon oil when using Coleman cylinders?

That's my understanding anyways. Airsoft myth?

Yes, Green gas, aka propane, has mixed in with silicone oil and the smell removed

Propane turned into "Green Gas" with this kit

http://airsoft-innovations.com/oil-pump-kit

Fixed.

My KJW MK1 although not full metal has been through hell and is no worse for the wear. It's been dropped, gotten wet, mags swelled from heating up after filling in cool air then getting far too hot in the sun. put them in my vice (very carefully with wooden blocks) and squeezed them back to normal. Plus you can "ghetto upgrade" it for free and get over 500fps out of it if you wanted. cons are it fits loose in most holsters and no blowback(better on gas though). I also have the carbine and they use the same mags so thats a plus. I've had for at least 5 yrs and only now I'm replacing 3 out of 6 mag fill valves ($3 each, 30 seconds to switch).